We want a 25p/24p mode Sony !

Magic!

@OZBIRD AMEN to That! :) 25p please.

this camera sucks it looks like 120hz tv's look..fake. we wanted interchangable lens cameras because we want digital cinema. sony should take a page out of phillips book.. they released a 2:35 cinema aspect tv..less frames please!

24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p2p424p24p24p24p24p2p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p24p!!!!!!!!

It's all about Depth of feild people.. Wow what bang for buck ! 24fps will come with firmfirm hopefully is Sony is as smart as canon. does it shoot P or just i ? please be P

yes I realise you spell field this way :P

I wish canon would realise some nice footage from there new camera like this !! Sony know how to market that is for sure.

Doesn't even Sony Learn from Canon's mistakes.
24/25P or it's a NO GO.

This is a camera that can easily be used for feature film production today, with no other changes.

It already does 25p in the PAL version, it's just written out as 50i. The actual footage is progressive and it's trivial to re-output it as 25p in any NLE.

If you want to master to 24fps for theatrical, do your entire production at 25fps and before you master, slow down the audio by 4% (extremely high quality with today's audio software -- and no pitch change) and force the framerate to be 24fps (no interpolation, "optical flow" or whatever -- use the same technique you would use to do slow mo).

This is a game changer: a Super35mm, interchangeable lens Sony Handycam for less than $2K.

The quality is awesome but I really don't like the bokeh in this footage. Oh, and I want 25P/30P!!!

This is exactly what I've been looking for.

Given the price tag Sony had to cut some features, and what else should they do other than making this a 60i/50i cam only.
Stupid thing is that that's a complete No Go for most videographers, so it'll be interesting who will buy this anyway.
Plus there are cheaper DSLR hybrids already available with variable framerates (and better codec performance with the GH1 hack).

Mmm...hard to believe I'll be in beautiful Bali in less than 24 hours!

Some great DOF, smooth, no rolling shutter, better than my hacked GH1?.... no way!!! vimeo.com/12864280 vimeo.com/13402640 still love the video though :) Added to vimeo.com/channels/worldhd

Whoa, nice move Sony..! But I think I'll wait for a while until this new game got more mature, I'll stick to my 550D for now.

Oh, I love Bali!

looks good......looks HD.

I've noticed that in reaction to this product launch, user forums across the Interwebs have been buzzing with cranky codgers who are turning up their noses at this product merely because it does not crank out video files in 24p, out-of-the-box.

As noted earlier in these comments, as soon as you lay down the video tracks from this camera into a non-linear video editor (e.g., Adobe Premiere Pro) - and who doesn't? - you have the ability to take the 60i file and, assuming your editing software is more than a toy, the 60i stream will interpolate to 30p or 24p without any problem. Remember, the APS sensor captures in progressive, but the camera is saving the footage into an interlaced container with a doubled framerate. Sony does this for two reasons: first, because they adjudged the simplicity of this approach to be most versatile (satisfying the need to capture fast motion while staging the signal path from 60i back to 30p/24p); and second, because they are predictably wedded to their own Blu-Ray standard, which notably does not have a 30p mode in its specifications at all and would take the 60i stream gracefully. I don't know if everyone realizes this, but Blu-Ray is the future of physical media and you're either going to burn to that, or downscale your footage considerably (making these debates pointless).

And after all that, the fundamental question is whether the complaints amount to anything in the real world. Would it have been preferable for Sony to provide more options, including 24p and 30p? Yes, always! But even if minor signal degradation occurs in the NLE going from 60i to 30p, can you see it?

I cannot, under even the most optimal circumstances shooting in AVCHD at a lower bitrate than this and with fast vertical motion. (I am referring to a careful A-B comparison on a Dell Ultrasharp U2711 panel viewing footage shot on a HDR-XR500V in AVCHD 17 Mbps that started as 1080i/60 and rendered out to 1080p/30.)

As usual, the crux of bitching and moaning is the usual suspect: gadget fanboys who have spent their lunch money on last season's toy and will defend it fiercly no-matter-what. Many of these people too have been compromising the hell out of their art, shooting with Canon 5DmkII and 7D D-SLRs using goofy rigs, separate audio capture and gelatin footage.

And I won't even get into the hilarity here of that whole 24p fetish, which is to say that amateur filmmakers presume jittery motion somehow instantaneously evokes the formality of cinematic art. Nonsense. Celluloid has much more to offer than 24 frames per second: detail, saturation, a low noise floor and a precious absence of digital artifacts. Moreover, I challenge anyone who insists on 24p to prove that they've ever once in their life gotten their footage printed onto celluloid (which is the reference point for their demand in the first place)!

Another reason not to buy a Sony: no 24p. The only good thing they make is the ps3.

wow, the camera is astonishing. I watch the video clip with my mouth open with awe. Look forward to get it as soon as it is launch in Singapore. This camera exactly meet my requirement.

the bokeh is weird (or at least different than expected). conforming to 24p is no big deal in post, as mentioned above. download the file and give it a go. impressive stuff for the price. documentary filmmakers are going to LOVE this little camera.

Great footage period.

nice nice nice nice 2000 dollar????????
hmmmmmmmmmmmm

My HV20 has nicer footage, not very impressed actually.

Eh, it's sharp, but the 5dII and 7d has a better look. This is just the start, what's up panasonic? nikon?

As a longtime Sony user, if only it had 1080p30 and 720p60, I would be pre-ordering one right now.

Sure an NLE can de-interlace the video stream, but it would have been so much more production-friendly if there was an option to record in progressive mode in the first place. Even on a fast multi-core computer, processing HD video takes quite a bit of time.

Perhaps Sony plans to release a pro version with more frame rate options and XLR inputs. But the Panasonic AG-AF100 is also on the horizon, so I guess I should hold off a bit longer.

At least things are getting very interesting in this area!

Does anybody know if this camera offers any kind of AF (for ENG etc) or is it only MF like the HD-SLRs ?

I couldn't seem to see anything in the literature about its stills/video focussing system...

the camera is a good 1st try model 1 start,mid entry level camera.
clearly very usable and stable even with it's limitations.
some more powerful higher end kit will be coming soon from sony.
the combo dslr accessories companies should be worried.
they could become as relevant as depth of field adapter companies.anyone still buying letus products?
the promo video above does the camera a terrible disservice.
an amazing location and piss poor visual execution not exceptable for a funded production project,stinky concept.
the design of the camera is cool and the ergonomics are fantastic.
this will sell very well as it is,plenty of tv people will buy this as is. dslr`s are so 2009.

After reading a lot of comments here and on other forums, the sum of opinions is very simply: no24/25p no party! Don't bother me like sentence that all you need is to deinterlace, I spent my first part of videomaker with consumer sony cameras (because we all talking about a consumer camera... A 2K$ consumer camera...) that record at 50i and than I'd to deinterlace them to 25p (I started with premiere 6.0, do you remeber? I'm not a "last minute guy") and I ensure you that there's a HUGE difference beetween deninterlaced 50i footage and view 25p footage, I made my experiment: same scene recorded with HV30, before 50i deinterlaced to 25p and than 25p and you NOTE the difference!! Even in this video (very good I must admit but from a interchangeable lens camera I expect to do not only documentary for Nat Geo but indie films, short movies, or I'll keep my HV30...) you can note that the motion is tipically obtained by a 50i footage.
I bet my leg that the next model (VG11??) will have "native 25p/24p" format.
Why you must buy the camera with lens, why don't sell the body only?? I've got all my contax and leica M lenses that are waiting for a camera like this.
And last: the price: IMHO is TOO HIGH!! Ok the lens itself is about 800$, so the cam is 1200$, but you got only the sensor of Nex5 (500$) with a better codec and a better microphone (the time limit for my uses is not a problem...), EVERYONE that is planning to pay 2K dollars in a camera doesn't buy it for the holydays but to do something more serius... So he starts to search forums opinions on this camera and found all this comments: no25/24p? no go!!! IMHO there's no future for this camera unless Sony doesn't add the 25p/24p feature....

So, why not MANUEL AUDIO for this price?

I want one, but...

I think the reason for it being only 60&50i is cause it's not a pro segment product and there's one, that was shown for a split of a second at this years NAB, that's coming in 2011 - am i right or am i right?
Same goes for no pro audio and lack of XLRs.

This camera is like FX1&7 (except sensor and quality wich are amazing here) it doesnt have all that an A camera needs for any kind of production.
I would gladly use it along with Z1's or anything else (better, like EX's) that looks video for shooting weddings, docs, interviews, concerts or whatever.
I wouldn't mind watching an indie film shoot with it. ;-)

This is a great product, but i'd rather spent 4-6k$ (not that i'm planing it right now, happy with my Canon A1) on the next one that'll be pro and have P-modes amongst other things i need - what will happen soon, i'm sure.

To be honest working with Z1's and FX's owners i shoot 99% of my work 50i, i use 25P for private videos and some weddings.

"Normal people" often prefer 50i to P and there are some that can make your life miserable if you shoot something with bokeh - that's in videography.

I have no expirience in the field of film production.

Erich ,

I also think better Sony changing in the spec or make statement , to mention Progressive in 60i by default, if not more and more people will be get wrong info.

just ask is possible to add 24P via firmware upgrade ? and is possible add 720p mode ? bcos i no need every time record in 1080i mode.

wow

This is a great camcorder. Its just a shame it does not have 24p for NTSC and 25p for PAL users.

Sony if you can please fix this in a firmware update.

1080 is so 2009!! :P It's great .. but I'll wait for something like Scarlet from RED ...

More of a concern than 60i is that the sensor only records in 30p for NTSC models. At least the PAL version is nicer at 25p in 50i wrapper. But this all needs a fix before I'm buying one.

I think this camera will not have good sharp picture (if you see the video). For home use it's ok. Waiting for release to see what we have for sure.

WTF. horrible 120hz tv's look. hope (sure) panasonic will release something better in september

cool camcorder, published at my website thenewcamera.com

Sony, was it so difficult to include 24p, RAW and mic control? The Canon 5D Mark II street price is almost the $2000 this camera costs and it has a 35mm sensor wich is more valuable than the quadmic of the VG10, and the funniest thing of all is that those three things doesn't really cost you. RAW wouldn't cut you sales from other departments, Canon and Nikon is already doing it and the video in DSLRs is already taking sales from video departments that the addition (not the absence) of RAW, 24p or mic control would go totally unnoticed. Also, the ones with the frustration of 24p or RAW will just buy the Mark II, the GH2 or the 7D wich is essentially this camera, but better (Low-noise 18 megapixels/RAW/24p). You really should add those features in a firmware update or before sell, it makes no sense not to have them. Just an advice.

I just watch the demo and I'm very upset - not with FPS but with quality of glass - pathetic. Bookeh is blah - to the point it hurts my eyes. Extreme blue fringing on high contrast edges (all the shots at the monastery). And overall colors reproduction - very soft and unsaturated. I want to see 3rd party reviews of this camera with other lenses to really determine the value of it. Any real pro videographer/flmmaker will wait for release of pro model - so Sony still have time to fix all the issues and work on their marketing as well.

eehhh bokeh is awful 0:35 & 1:19

apart from the interlaced footage, it looks like as if it lacks dynamic range in comparison to e.g. a 5D... we´ll see what the HF100 and the next-generation Canons are capable of...

CONFIRMED -- IT SHOOTS PROGRESSIVE


Amazing -- over and over it is posted that the sensor shoots either 25p or 30p that is recorded as 50i and 60i and folks still claim they won't buy the camcorder because they want progressive video.

The recording format has no relevance other than during the recording stage. Sony records as "interlace" because everything downstream in the video world is compatible with 50i and 60i.

Once in a progressive timeline the fields stop being fields and become frames. There are no interlace artifacts! No deinterlacing is necessary because the images are NOT interlaced!

This also means even if your editor can only edit interlace, it will still edit the video and you'll be editing progressive video.

The images are progressive so if you buy a region 50 unit you get 25p. Stop posting you want 25p. You've got it. And, if you have 25p you've got 24p via a slowdown during export. (This is simply the reverse of how film is converted to video in PAL areas.)

If you buy a region 60 unit, you've got 30p. Should you make a great movie, no one is going to notice 30p verses a 24p frame-rate.

Now if you really want 24p, buy a PAL camcorder from the PAL dept of a famous NYC camera store. Then slow down 25 to 24.

PS1: why is Sony saying 50i/60i? One reason is that, as demonstrated here, way too many people do not understand what PsF is. Two, many folks would be confused about how to edit progressive. Three, they may have an understanding with another company that they will not market "progressive" consumer camcorders. Four, this may be dictated by the "pro" group that wants to keep CineAlta available only on $6000 camcorders.

Nevertheless, not saying anything about progressive seems a horrible marketing error given that the main market for this camera demands progressive! Perhaps Japan dictated this policy as they have always been very negative toward progressive for consumers. It's as strange as AVCHD LITE claiming it is 60p but only shooting 30p.

Frankly, I'm surprised they took AVCHD to 24Mbps. This makes it the same as NXCAM.

The real downside is that those that want smooth motion will likely find they hate the look of 25p and 30p.

PS: lack of sharpness seen on an highly compressed Internet video? Not surprising. But, how do you know what the sharpness and saturation were set at? Maybe the shooter was trying for his version of a film look.


PS: The comments about the built in mic come from someone who has obviously not looked up what's available from Sony for the cold shoe.

Stunning! Loved till 03:20. I like design of camera, look like steal.

Does anyone know why film adopted 24 fps in the first place?Perhaps it's a compromise between performance and economy.At one time there were at least as many different types of film standards.Odd perspective's,different sprocket arrangements.Perhaps it was the projector costs that drove this standard we consider the Holy grail.Coming from audio there was mechanical vs. tubes,tubes vs. transistors,transistors vs. IC chips and now analogue vs. digital.Each time a new technology is released there is an learning cure while the tech. comes up to speed.Some of us are into reality and 24P only simulates it.P.S. Take it from an audio guy,get it right in the first place,post production fixes are distortion,something from nothing i.e..

I think Sony has created this camera as an entry level camcorder to create cinematic results. If anyone saw the NAB coverage, you would realise that Sony is bringing out a whole range of cinematic 35mm cameras that produce stunning results. The bokeh was harder edged in a couple of the earlier shots, but then looked really nice in others, so it is hard to determine the overall results here. I wouldn't concern yourselves with 24p, easy to rectify using Cinema Tools - but I guess that depends on your NLE of choice. Still for a camera that is 2k in price US, it is a game changer and a very capable little camcorder. I think people forget how far technology has come in such a short period of time.

Pretty pictures but Sony forgot 24p, motorless zoom and lanc connection. I'll not buy it.

XLR inputs - even as an optional 'add-on' as per JVC GY-HM100 or Panasonic Ag-HMC41 would have convinced me to purchase! Picture quality is good, but what about the audio?

And what about 24Mbs ? I'm not a profesional but I think it's too much compresion, isn't it? And will be posible to set up a other kind of lens, I mean, like Nikon, Canon, or 35mm profesional ? Thanks!

For the 24fps it's a Panasonic Camcorder coming on December AF100