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Many thanks to Mitch Aunger (Planet5D) for getting this story rolling and spreading the word.
home.planet5d.com

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This is my method for transferring 8mm footage using the Canon 5Dmk2 in real time. The results are very good for such a fast method if you cannot afford the money or time for frame scanning.

00:42 - It very important to use a flat type LED's not the dome shaped ones. The dome shape LED's will give you lots of blooming and the focus will drift at the edges making you suspect the lens.

00:58 - I drilled 3 holes in the body of the projector for the LED flexible light strip, behind where the original bulb used to sit. I mask out light I don't want projected with putty. The position of the lights helps mask out some of the scratches. I need to add another couple of (horizontal) lights either side of the centre light.

01:29 - I modified the original projector lens to try and achieve a flat field image. Made from the rear element from a Carl Zeiss Flektogon 35mm and attached to the original lens tube with a bit a tape no less. You could use standard lens and there are some very nice ones out there.

03:08 - Utilising the body from the old 35mm lens, it proved a good way in shielding the projector from light pollution, I also added a 12mm extension tube. A lens cloth draped over the front further seals the light from entering, of course you could just film in very low light.

00:12 - I put 2 drive belts on the motor, this slowed the motor down just enough to reduce the shutter flicker. The Canon 5Dmk2 was set to 24p and 1/50 for our electrical phase.

ISO ranged from base up to 1000, depending on exposure of original film. The footage is fine at ISO 1000 but this could be reduced by using a more powerful flat lens LED.

03:30 - Focus and frame size changed by moving the projector or camera and adjusting the screw type lens. Try and focus on the film grain and not the scratches.

00:37 - I removed the internal mask for 8mm & S8mm aspects at the gate to project an unrestricted image into the camera. You gain areas that are hidden but they have the perfs though them and you see the top and bottom of the next and previous frame, but you can re-mask in post. If it's personal footage you want to see everything on the frame, some times it makes the difference.

You can use the crop sensor DSLR's but the lens would need changing or modifying unless you wanted a cropped image. On this lens and projector I can not bring the camera near enough without fouling on the body of the camera or projector body to get a full image captured.

I have tried to make this project as accessible as possible and apart from the camera, all the items are fairly cheap to pick up.

Projector used: Eumig Mark 501, I also use the Eumig 610D & the Eumig Mark DL
Camera: Canon 5Dmk2

Ref LED: maplin.co.uk/dc-12-v-flexible-led-light-strip-400mm-47376

Here are links to a couple of films transferred using this exact setup:
vimeo.com/20900718
vimeo.com/20871186

I have other 8mm transfers back from when I started this 2 years ago, but the quality was not as good. They are further down my videos.

Credits

Likes

  • Ron Coker plus 11 months ago
    A sterling effort! Most interesting.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks Ron
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  • Stephen Judge plus 11 months ago
    fascinating process. I've done really expensive 8mm TK sessions in London on Da Vinci suites that don't look as good. Well done.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    That's interesting to hear. It started off just wanting to transfer the family reels, if it helps others do the same then I'm happy.

    Now to setup a wet gate transfer! That would be fun.

    Thanks, James
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  • Stephen Judge plus 11 months ago
    Wet gate is good, you can also get the reel ultrasonically cleaned at the processing stage (unless you love that dirty scratchy look of course)
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Right, note to self: Add an electric toothbrush to setup. :)
  • Stephen Judge plus 11 months ago
    Now you're talking!
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  • Ben 11 months ago
    Great idea to transfer. I put them indirectly through the screen, but this is very handsome!
    I don't know if it's possible with the 8mm projector of eumig.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks, Ben. What model?
  • Ben 11 months ago
    Eumig P8 Automatic. You can see the projector in this video: vimeo.com/18143868.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Cheers Ben, The P8 is such a beautiful projector it would be a shame to modify. I would purchase something like the Eumig 610D. Although the P8 has a protruding lens that may help frame the image with your current lens.
  • Ben 11 months ago
    Thanks James for your thoughts and information! It's indeed a beautiful projector and the capture from the screen is not so bad.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    And at the end of the day, there's something magical about getting the projector out, projecting it's light and showing the family.
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  • Oliver Wilkins plus 11 months ago
    Just brilliant, and no more melting film.

    I will study this repeatedly. Thanks a million for such a beautiful tutorial.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Hi Oliver, thanks. I do love the effect left be melting film though, just not to often.
    It's nice leaving the film in the gate with LED, also its a great way to capture stills.
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  • Tomas Bianchi 11 months ago
    Amazing method. I have tons of old 8mm film that i've never had the money to transfer. I'll look into buying an old projector.

    What music is that? I've heard it before, i just cant put my finger on it.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    The credits right at the end. It's the theme to 'Cinema Paradiso' - Ennio Morricone. Seemed very fitting, and also one of my favourite films.
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  • Studio West Video plus 11 months ago
    Very clever!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks Studio West Video
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  • Mike Wilkins pro 11 months ago
    Now I have no excuse for not transferring 100 rolls of family films ;-) Thanks for sharing !
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Pleasure!
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  • Brent Campanelli plus 11 months ago
    The most cinematic How-To I've seen in awhile!
    Amazing idea.. I hate the quality I get from digital transfer being fed from the projector to quicktime recorder..
    I'd like to try this out one day!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Cheers, My poor 5Dmk2 has put up with some stuff, the lens is off more than on.
    #sensorabuse
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  • John Leonard 11 months ago
    Clever clever... Even though I don't have any film to transfer, I thoroughly enjoyed watching this. The presentation and music were a fantastic combination. I felt like I was watching a short film rather than a tutorial.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks John, film some new 8mm stuff then you will ;)
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  • illdog plus 11 months ago
    really good stuff man! excellent!!!
  • illdog plus 11 months ago
    & best soundtrack ever!!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Isn't it - love the film Cinema Paradiso extended version, can't think why they cut so much out for the American market, it fills in all the gaps.
  • illdog plus 11 months ago
    oh they did cut stuff out for US market?? vandals!!:)
    hope you dont mind if i post ur video on a small indierental blog i have here: weareroadkill.wordpress.com/
    actually that d be my first post!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Help yourself.
    All the extended scenes are on youtube part 1-4 youtube.com/watch?v=EWTYTICJdj0&feature=fvwrel
  • illdog plus 11 months ago
    yeah ive seen them! what an amazing movie...
    thanks a lot James!
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  • Johannes Greve Muskat plus 11 months ago
    That is so, so cool!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks, Johannes
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  • dmente 11 months ago
    Emotive. Super!
    Posted in estoesdmente.com/blog/?p=196
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Cheers!
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  • Nathan Oldfield plus 11 months ago
    Phew...old world meets new. You're so clever mate. This was a pleasure to watch. Truly a wonderfully crafted piece.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Hi Nathan, thats very kind. Cheers.
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  • David Brewer 11 months ago
    I didn't know where you were going with this until the ending. They don't make movies today like this one!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    :)
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  • Harriet Macdonald 11 months ago
    wow! So clever:)
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks Harriet
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  • Jens-Chr. Strandos plus 11 months ago
    Amazing idea:-) Well done!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks, Jens-Chr
    I first tried this 2 years ago on a Kodak Brownie pointing the light into the 5Dmk2, saw an blurry image and thought this may have legs...
  • Jens-Chr. Strandos plus 11 months ago
    I sure will try this myself:-) Have lots of films my father shot at my early years. Thanks for the idea.
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  • frank rudolf plus 11 months ago
    very nice way to transfer
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks Frank, would have liked a Müeller system but a Miller will have to do ;)
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  • Eliana Alvarez plus 11 months ago
    Just amazing!! :)
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks, Eliana
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  • good stuff!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thank You Stuart.
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  • Ryan Williams 11 months ago
    Very Nice! I wish I could clap through comments.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Ha, Cheers
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  • Josh Friedberg 11 months ago
    Thanks James, great work and a beautiful tutorial!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Very kind thanks Josh.
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  • 4D3 / Animation Studio plus 11 months ago
    very very beautiful James. Did you record directly on internal card or other system?. Congratulations and thanks!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Hi Marcos, thanks. Yes to internal card.
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  • André Weigel 11 months ago
    Wow! Great job...
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks André
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  • Oli Kember plus 11 months ago
    Very very cool, the 5D really has its finger in every pie.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    I know, is there anything it can't be used for :)
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  • Myles Thompson plus 11 months ago
    I'm not clear on how to add the drive belt. The rest I could probably achieve with my limited mechanical abilities. Any tips on that part?
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    It was just a quick way on slowing down the pulley a fraction, dont worry too much about this point. You need to first see how flicker free you image is.
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  • Irrum plus 11 months ago
    Nice results. I like your fearless attitude to taking cameras/lenses apart. A great bit of video here to match.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    I'm a fiddler, cheers james
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  • Blackwatch Videography plus 11 months ago
    Bravo James
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thank you Blackwatch
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  • Roger Dominguez 11 months ago
    James, you're a genius! Thanks a lot for your research
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Cheers Roger, very kind ;)
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  • Brutal!!
    Estoy pensando en comprarte el que tienes o me montas uno, dime algo.

    Saludos.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Saludos Antonio.
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  • Joe Moya plus 11 months ago
    Ingenious... thanks for the tutorial...
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Hi Jo, thanks for watching.
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  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thank you for all you kind comments, means a lot. - James
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  • Hi James. Thanks for this. The samples are beautiful. We have had some issues with transfers using a 5D that gives us a shutter roll. I assume that's what you are addressing with the extra belt? I have been able to adjust the roll slightly with a dimmer switch that I set up on the projector, but not eliminate it completely. I understand this problem is common with CMOS cameras. How did you fix it completely? Thanks again. -- andy
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Hi, since using the flat strip led and the belt adjustment the 'roll' has been reduced, although you may detect it slightly.

    Camera set to PAL then 24p at 1/50 seem to do the trick for me.
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  • Justin Ho 11 months ago
    Wonderful idea!
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  • Ivan Chong 11 months ago
    What is the music used? its so beautiful
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Theme to 'Cinema Paradiso' - Ennio Morricone
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  • Gargamel 11 months ago
    Hi James,
    Thank you for sharing your setup (amazing idea indeed), and congratulations for these very good captures.
    I'm an "amateur transferrer" too, using projector + lens + camcorder ("lens in lens" mode), but your setup allows to work with less lenses... It's a very good way to explore.
    In postprod, did you try to stabilize and clean the video through an AviSynth script (as videoFred ans others do), after a transcoding.
    Thank you again!
    Andre.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Hi Andre, there was no post clean up or stabilisation done. I'm mac based, do they do AviSynth scripts on OSX?.

    Not sure if my brain can handle much more at the moment, fingers in to many pies! If I learn about AviSynth I'd probably forget how to walk.

    I'll have a look into it when I can, thanks Andre.
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  • Gargamel 11 months ago
    Ha, sorry, for the Mac world you have to wait for the next AviSynth 3.0 ;-)
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  • Emily Paup plus 11 months ago
    WOW. This is amazing. I'm fascinated with all hybrid mixings of film and digital! Great work!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Thanks Emily
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  • Danny Mendoza plus 11 months ago
    Congrats! Excellent way to preserve memories
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Cheers Danny
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  • Edwin Haverkamp 11 months ago
    Very nice! No problem with the different framerates?
    You fixed that with "Camera set to PAL then 24p at 1/50 seem to do the trick for me." ?
    Because that's the problem when you try to record it from the projection on a wall.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Hi Edwin, 24p seem to show less roll then 25p but 1/50 shutter is for UK electrical phase 50 Htz.

    You will always have frame tearing but with this method but with this medium it's not distracting.

    You can wind cotton or light string around the pulley from the motor to slow it down a fraction.

    I used another belt in tandem, they kind of counteract off each other and slow it down a wee bit.
  • Edwin Haverkamp 11 months ago
    Thank you! I'll give this a try when I find the time. Looking forward to it :)
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  • Shari Bee 11 months ago
    ahhhh, brilliant, and a total pleasure to watch - i find myself smiling at the end when it all comes together, like a plot unfolding in the last few minutes of a beautiful movie. thank you, looking forward to trying this out!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Good luck, if you have any questions please ask.
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  • Philip Han 11 months ago
    G E N I U S ! ! !

    I cannot believe it's taken so long for someone to come up with something like this! I don't shoot 8mm film but innovation like this keeps Analog alive a little bit longer!
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Cheers, Philip
  • Philip Han 11 months ago
    I wrote up a little rant on my Blog about this and I came across the memory that Magic Lantern has 2K/4K recording and 1:1 pixel mapping and extreme bitrates etc... You should flash your 5D's firmware with this and try out some extreme resolutions! You could then process the frames in special software to remove noise, stutter, dust, scratches, and whatnot followed by downsampling which should yield better results than canon's standard 1080p.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Hi Philip, I tried the ML for increased 2k bitrates awhile ago, it was hit and miss. I used a bit of card to mask the chip to maintain a higher bitrates: mmfilm.co.uk/mmfilm/archives/789

    You could goto town, frame editing but I wanted something quick and easy once setup.
  • Philip Han 11 months ago
    Mhmmm, interesting!

    Perhaps you could start manufacturing Sensor Masks for Canon cameras just like the Holga's 6x6 and 6x4.5 Masks. I call a 20/80 share for the marketing idea! Hahaha

    Well I was just suggesting that because once you have a workflow going you could just script Automator to pull files from a folder, run them through the processing, and then batch export them to folders for archiving, full resolution finals, and web sized videos... Nowadays with the new MacBook Pro's with Quadcore i7's this should only take an hour at most for one reel from capture to export.
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Ha, food for though, thanks.
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  • GoogBabe 11 months ago
    Newbee question: Is the LED modification is required ?

    I would try on my uncle 8mm projector (do no the brand) but he die if I "customize it'
    Yeah i know, he's a conservative guy :)
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Hi GoogBabe (if that is your real name) ;)

    The standard 50w/25w bulbs would burn out your film and punch a hole through the frame if you leave the film in the gate with no motion. Some projectors have heat proof glass protection for slow frame rate modes but they still get hot quick.

    Also you will have to put ND film or hold a filter in front of camera to reduce the brightness to get down to the sync shutter speeds.

    You could just remove the bulb and fix the flat strip led to the back of the case.

    Make sure the light is lined up through the gate to the camera sensor. Don't have more than one light source as the picture will be terrible. If using strip light led, mask out the other led's not used.

    You have to get the alinement just right with the illumination. If the led is too bright put ND filter film over the led and hold in place with putty like 'BlueTak'. Or place it in front of the camera.

    You don't want to diffuse the light too much otherwise you will get blooming in the highlights.

    Cheers, James
  • GoogBabe 11 months ago
    Thx a Lot James

    Seem not so easy (about the image syncro) but i'll do my best!

    A thx for your great sharing of "savoir faire"
  • James Miller plus 11 months ago
    Don't worry too much about sync, after all every time you see a video emulating the 8mm look they put flicker back in. ;)
    Get a flat bright focussed image first then worry about the rest later.
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