
Peter Joseph's July 25th 2009 Zeitgeist Movement Lecture: London , UK
2 years ago
Peter Joseph's July 25th 2009 Zeitgeist Movement Lecture: London , UK
Entitled "Where are we now?"
thezeitgeistmovement.com
Entitled "Where are we now?"
thezeitgeistmovement.com
MP4
01:08:56
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(P.S. Also - earnest congratulations on the likelihood that Zeitgeist: The Movie, has probably (as of Aug 2009) been viewed by around 100 million worldwide, and as noted elsewhere, 10k views day for the equally excellent Addendum. It's just a pity that (so far at least) with only around 0.5% signing up to the movement (even so, an impressive number as it accelerates toward the half mill mark, admittedly!) there are still too many choosing to 'take the blue pill' ... no doubt this has to change, though!)
It would make further distribution easier. :)
You have my support and thanks!
His Egalitarian society that he exemplifies in the end of the lecture, the hunter and gatherer society, is stuck in the dark ages. We were only able to creep upon this new 'technosociety' that he advocates through incentive and advancement and not complacency. This is only one possible hole that I can see in my first viewing. Does anyone have a comment on this counter?
The society we have today is a result of the creative ingenuity of human beings, which occurs through many incentives- be it monetary gain, the desire to see improvement, et al,.
I think a good example might be someone who has Ulcerative Colitis (as I personally do) becoming a doctor with the wish of improving the lives of people specifically with that disease. Their incentive is the cessation of suffering for others (likely along with other incentives).
So there are so many incentives today, and there will be in the future - the important thing for society is to find the higher and more beneficial incentives.
One thing is for sure, a life without exorbitant interest, greed, and dishonesty would be nice. How do you propose to reeducate the educators? The people that have created the establishment we currently reside may not be willing to change to an economic structure they are no longer masters of. A movement from the ground level could be interesting and when enough people change in direction, the world will change as well.
Lastly... are we talking centralized or decentralized control? Communistic or laissez faire? I know these are absolute terms, but it helps to have parameters.
What is advocated is "begone with the notion of property" and "full access to everyone to the stuff they need/want". This is better explained in the second part of this lecture series vimeo.com/7938805
youtube.com/watch?v=CIINgQ1TooE
YOU ARE THE BEST!
yours truly,
Ryan J Witt
You Rock!
DOMESTICATED.US
Finally something that makes sense.
Thanks a lot Peter!
I hope we will get a many more speeches like this.
The showing of Q&A would've been equally granted, I'm sure ;)
Epiphany is putting it mildly after reading all of P.J.'s posts concerning sociology and psychology on the Z site....
He's phenomenal and inspiring!
That's at least one hour into Addendum before we even begin to consider that.
I absolutely love the 'enemy' being replaced by a friendly 'vision'. Many thanks again for broadening my perspecitve.
thanks for this
I find no job, I owe a lot of rent maybe they're going to kick me out, I have no relation with my parents, I steal food, but this is no life, I'm about to hustle and I don't want, I'm an artist but if I want to live off it I gotta do something that sells and Zeitgheist doesn't, not yet...so WHAT THE FUCK CAN I DO?
Start planting wheet, potatos and so on.
In that case you might survive even without job.
Anyway, when will appear the Peter's second lecture?
It's been already few days since it and still nothing.
Peter, know that you truly touched deeply with your Zeitgeist movies and this lecture. We need more people like you in the world, with the guts to go on public and say what you have to say to make a better world. Especially after all the 'terrors' that happen to the people that do not abide or are in the way of the corrupt system.
Being strategic is extremely important. My fear is that the people in power, as has been for the last millennia, will try and perpetuate their subjugation even after the Venus project becomes a reality, as a matter of vice. Psychological perversion is one mean bastard. Hopefully you have a very smart solution for it.
So, when can I start programming the AI for your machines? :)
You have been able to put in clear, concise manner ideas that were all over the place. It all comes together for a better future, for the evolution of our species. People have to start thinking outside the conditioned box in order to be really free from suffering. Anytime I preached these ideas I was told: 'greed is human nature'.
Thank you for proving it isn't and doing something about it!
I admire your courage Peter, you have taken on a monster task, I am behind you 100% and will share this information to everyone I meet!
I think i will open a new site soon to support this movement.
Thank you
most of all... truly FREE. this is a peak into the future of our race. either we take hold of the opportunity or we drown in our own device. we must wake up and take charge. this is the time...the time is now. live it, breath it, think it, do it, be it...everyday, every moment for the duration...thanks for posting.
The point is that it takes time for anyone to open up because that is really deep questioning.
May you have the patience to keep on pushing long enough for more power to join you.
I am helping in talking about this around me, but people are reluctant to take the time to question there view of the world. And the opposing forces are tremendously powerful.
The only comment I have about what you are doing is that it is brilliant. Brilliant.
Good lecture....when do we start?
We support the Zeitgeist Movement and the Venus Project! Happy ZDay 2010!
DOMESTICATED.us
And parts of it, that are simply not true in my opinion.
As some people have proven, freedom of choice do exist even in very extreme circumstances (vide: Victor Frankl), and saying that people are "doomed" because of their demographic and social (or whatever it was) conditions is simply not true.
Of course the machinery of capitalism along with religion are hindering the human ambitons, but can not destroy it. Words "you're absolutely restricted, you have no freadom, because you're forced to do the work as it is" are utter and complete bullshit. The only real restriction on people are people. Using this guy's words: it's amazing to me how many times I get this argument with average John Doe... Truth is, most of the people on this globe, think exactly what this guy is saying here - you're restricted, you have no freedom, and it's going to be like that as long as the system is in place, which means realistically until the day you die. It's very refreshing that not everyone is sold on reactive thinking like this, and that humanity is proving it wrong time and time again. The truth is: you're not restricted by anything but your own mind. I work doing exactly what I want to do - I changed my life long time ago, dropped the job I didn't like, and started living my own life. Part of it is helping people. It's my choice, nobody else's
We are at the time of unlimited access to information, and everyone can get any data he wants. The problem is distinguishing between true and false.
That said, I do believe capitalism is "doomed" and it's going to decline in direct proportion to the cosciousness of "humanity". At the same time listening to what this guy says is rather depressing and discouraging for someone who really wants to change something in his life.
I don't see how freedom of choice can be "proven," but it can be defined in various ways. And the ideas that some people are absolutely restricted & have no freedom are not "utter and complete bullshit" as you suggest. What would you say to the nearly 16,000 children who are going to die from hunger tomorrow? Would you say, "You’re not restricted by anything but you own mind," and tell them that their demographic and social conditions are irrelevant?
It seems that there are different degrees of freedom of choice, dependent upon the socioeconomic conditions into which one is born. The 15,000+ children who die each day from hunger have virtually no freedom of choice or social mobility. It takes education, resources, and opportunity to be able to take charge of your own destiny. Think seriously about the environment that you were born into and raised in. I commend you for dropping the bad job, taking charge, and changing your own life, but those options aren't equally available to everyone. Furthermore, there are many who have even more social mobility than you do. I'm not defending laziness, inaction, or submission; but I believe that the "American Dream" is worth pursuing for maybe only 5-10% of the world's population. I'm not stating this as fact; it's my OPINION, based on the information available to me.
And speaking of information – you also said that "We are at the time of unlimited access to information." If this was true, then everyone in the world would have high-speed, unrestricted internet access. Everyone would have equal access to schools and education, professors of Ivy League colleges, libraries, laboratories and other research facilities, tools, and whatever else may be necessary for gathering information. In fact, if everyone had unlimited access to information, then the US Congress and the American people could have studied the information that Bush supposedly used to justify war in Iraq. We could publicly discuss the tax evasion, offshore bank accounts, and money laundering of the big corporations. We could read and discuss the nearly 3,000 violations that Massey’s mine in Montcoal (the one that exploded earlier this week and killed 25 miners) has been cited with in the last 15 years. But unfortunately, this kind of information is highly restricted and inaccessible by almost anyone until it's too late. I've presented 3 examples; there are millions more. Of course, none of this would be an issue in a resource based economy.
Sorry to ramble. I wasn't planning to write nearly this much. You just said so many things that I took issue with. I do agree with you, though, that it is depressing and discouraging; and I definitely agree that capitalism will ultimately fail, as every other money-based economy has and will. We need to move into a resource-based economy; and the sooner, the better.
I vote for the addition of these lectures to any education curriculum world wide.
youtube.com/watch?v=CIINgQ1TooE
I agree there are semantic loopholes in what I wrote, and I can't expect everyone to understand "what author meant". Mea culpa
The part that is "simply not true" is the one I mentioned, and it's expressed in unfortunate sentence: "you're absolutely restricted, you have no freedom, because you're forced to do the work as it is".
First the addressee is whole world's society, including me. I know it's not true, because I - for one - am not "absolutely restricted and forced to do work as it is". So this sentence is "simply not true" and I can easily defend it. As much as we can try to discuss the levels of restriction, there is only one understaning of the word "absolutely" and the way mr Joseph used it is plain wrong.
Next thing is - mean culpa - my unfortunate use of words "unlimited access to information". I made the same mistake as mr Joseph.
The information is not unlimited - for example there is no access to MI6 or CIA secret files. Plus of course war in Iraqu.
But the nuances of the war in Iraq are not the most important ones for average Joe, to improve his life by changing the job for something he truly want's to do, have good, loving relationships with people, be healthy and happy etc. To the contrary - it's vastly unsignificant for solving his fundamental needs. Access to the information you mentioned is important for very narrow group of people. Plus there is a good chance that reliable information simply doesn't exist - it's blurred as too many people intermingle with the bits of it.
So to make a long story short, what I meant by "unlimited access to information" meant access to the infromation needed to not be ""absolutely restricted, and have no freadom, because you're forced to do the work as it is".
This is what I tried to say but my message got lost in translation and unfortunate use of words.
This discussion is indirectly proving this access.
And the last thing. You ask me for positive proofs. I want to point out that mr Josephs lecture is very superfical and lacks the proofs itself in most parts. He's mentioning facts witnout giving it's sources in many cases.
That's why my reply was superficial and general.
And don't get me wrong - he HAD to be this way, because otherwise whole discussion would get stuck - we'd be questioning sources, definitions etc.